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Author Topic: [Solved] wlan1 sometimes does not exist after boot  (Read 4581 times)

Offline Rich

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Re: [Solved] wlan1 sometimes does not exist after boot
« Reply #15 on: February 21, 2022, 06:32:58 AM »
Hi centralware
@GNUser: The concept of a wall-powered laptop not being able to power a radio (wifi) sounds rather odd, ...
I guess you missed this part:
... The laptop is old and always has the wireless adapter as well as two other USB devices plugged in. ...

Quote
... Since you have introduced a powered USB hub and seemingly have a working platform, you've added two new things to the mix: fresh copper pads (the USB sockets the radio plugs into) and Vcc (a secondary power supply). ...
Yes, but prior to adding the powered hub he did this:
... I replaced the device with a different one and now wlan1 shows up after boot 100% of the time. (Old device was Atheros, new one is Ralink ...

Offline gadget42

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Re: [Solved] wlan1 sometimes does not exist after boot
« Reply #16 on: February 21, 2022, 11:05:40 AM »
re: cleaning electronics/plastics/etc...

make sure you ONLY use PLASTIC SAFE contact cleaner!!!

use the non-plastic type and your plastics will NEVER be the same EVER again!

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The fluctuation theorem has long been known for a sudden switch of the Hamiltonian of a classical system Z54 . For a quantum system with a Hamiltonian changing from... https://forum.tinycorelinux.net/index.php/topic,25972.msg166580.html#msg166580

Offline CentralWare

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Re: [Solved] wlan1 sometimes does not exist after boot
« Reply #17 on: February 22, 2022, 12:02:56 AM »
@Rich:
Quote
... I replaced the device with a different one and now wlan1 shows up after boot 100% of the time. (Old device was Atheros, new one is Ralink ...
Correct; thus why I responded.  (Atheros sounds to be oxy/corroded and if it's been sitting in the same USB port for some time, this tends to be shared with the host port.)

@gadget42: I suggested iso alcohol as a starting point, not contact cleaner.  Being a 30+ year veteran engineer and Master C.E.T., I try not to advise people to use chemicals they're unfamiliar with.  If symptoms improve after my recommendation (theory realized) but aren't perfect or are intermittent, I usually suggest a technician; some of the chemicals in my truck for electronics requires PUCO/DOT licensing just to tote them around; I'm surely not going to assume someone on a forum I've never met has a clue how to use, handle, dispose of and not blow themselves up with one of these items!  Additionally, "plastic" is hardly a term that can be used considering the numerous materials that are used to manufacture jacks, edge-card connectors, sockets and other male/female devices.  These materials range from polyurethane based compounds (aka: Thermo-Plastics) to ABS and Nylon; all of which would react differently to certain acidic and/or corrosive chemicals, thus the suggestion around Iso Alcohol - it's readily available, a "reasonably good" cleaning agent, dries quickly, low electronics risk factor and save for being flammable, you don't hear about people exploding/detonating anything due to iso fumes.

Offline Rich

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Re: [Solved] wlan1 sometimes does not exist after boot
« Reply #18 on: February 22, 2022, 06:01:40 AM »
Hi centralware
... (Atheros sounds to be oxy/corroded ...
My mistake. I misread what you wrote. I thought you were refering to the laptops USB port.  :-[

Offline gadget42

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Re: [Solved] wlan1 sometimes does not exist after boot
« Reply #19 on: February 22, 2022, 08:32:14 AM »
most folks are familiar with walmart and they carry one of our favorites:
https://www.walmart.com/ip/CRC-Electronic-Cleaner-Quick-Dry-for-Sensitive-Electronics-11-oz/16817418
The fluctuation theorem has long been known for a sudden switch of the Hamiltonian of a classical system Z54 . For a quantum system with a Hamiltonian changing from... https://forum.tinycorelinux.net/index.php/topic,25972.msg166580.html#msg166580

Offline CentralWare

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Re: [Solved] wlan1 sometimes does not exist after boot
« Reply #20 on: February 23, 2022, 10:34:44 AM »
@gadget42: I've used that can once on an old dial-style am/fm radio; it could just be the scenario at hand, but it seemed to have left a white powdery residue when it dried; thus we've avoided it since.  Any similar results on your end?
@Rich: The sad truth to electronics (physics with metals in general, too) is when two different metals make contact over a period of time, the composition tends to lead to a chemical reaction between the metals.  For example, back in the day when all homes and businesses were piped with copper water lines...  many people used (much cheaper) steel and aluminum/tin straps to bolt the plumbing to the structure - which on the date of the installation looks just as professional, but because of the different metals being pressed against one another for long periods of time, it causes a special type of break-down.
See: https://www.google.com/search?q=galvanic+corrosion
Now the funny part with electronics (such as USB ports, PCI, etc.) is people talk about how gold pads on cards make for better conductivity - which is true...  however, if the partnering side is not also gold (most are copper) you run into the same situation.
In the Op's case, there's a very good chance the WiFi PCB is "coated" (oxidized) and if it's true, the female pins within the laptop are also subject to the same residue.  When you make a clean connection (new USB hub, especially if self powered) you're taking pins 1 and 4 out of the equation.  Remove the power from the hub and you're likely to start seeing problems.  (A USB Port voltage meter would be a good way to prove the situation as to whether or not there's ample juice to power the WiFi device; wiggle the meter in the USB socket and it may even black out if connectivity is that bad.) From a technician's perspective, both the device and the laptop are burnished/cleaned, tested for proper feed voltage and ground and then burn-tested to ensure the problem no longer exists. (Granted, in today's day, most techs working on an old XP laptop would instead respond with "...it's old.  Get a real machine!"  Sad to imagine what they think about older people instead of tech.

Offline gadget42

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Re: [Solved] wlan1 sometimes does not exist after boot
« Reply #21 on: February 23, 2022, 11:15:20 AM »
@centralware: it will sometimes haze any residual flux left over from soldering(a cotton swap and a little extra flushing usually gets rid of that). other times it will flush out old/caked/dried-out lubricants and those can leave powder/residue/streaks/traces(again, cotton swaps and some extra flushing usually washes it away)

also regarding the "what they think about older people"...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soylent_Green

or perhaps:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Obsolete_Man

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The fluctuation theorem has long been known for a sudden switch of the Hamiltonian of a classical system Z54 . For a quantum system with a Hamiltonian changing from... https://forum.tinycorelinux.net/index.php/topic,25972.msg166580.html#msg166580

Offline Rich

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Re: [Solved] wlan1 sometimes does not exist after boot
« Reply #22 on: February 23, 2022, 09:33:52 PM »
Hi centralware
Yes, I'm familiar with galvanic reactions. 25 years ago I started sailing when my friend got a sailboat. I've freed
up my share of Stainless steel screws holding Aluminum fittings. Those 2 are pretty much at the opposite ends
of the galvanic series.

Offline CentralWare

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Re: [Solved] wlan1 sometimes does not exist after boot
« Reply #23 on: February 24, 2022, 01:50:36 AM »
@gadget: It's time to grind up the neighbors!  (Cover reads: "...It's the year 2022...")
Thanks for the 5-in-the-morning grin to both of you!

Offline gadget42

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Re: [Solved] wlan1 sometimes does not exist after boot
« Reply #24 on: February 24, 2022, 06:51:39 AM »
i'd rather be sailing...

speaking of sailing:
https://badnarik.org/category/sailing/

as always, YMMV(your mileage may vary)

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The fluctuation theorem has long been known for a sudden switch of the Hamiltonian of a classical system Z54 . For a quantum system with a Hamiltonian changing from... https://forum.tinycorelinux.net/index.php/topic,25972.msg166580.html#msg166580