Extend .info file

[Guy]

You have a good starting point, but I think the list in the wiki can be improved and added to.

For example, I suggest

Include the category - office

Change web to - internet

[bmarkus]

My original idea was a simple tagging with no categories. However if community is preferring categories, why not use freedesktop.org categories (including sub-categories) instead of reinventing the wheel? Even if this is not perfect is ready and for sure they went through the pain. And it woulb be useful in DE supporting freedekstop.org like LXDE, Xfce4, KDE? Gnome.

[vinnie]

Personally I don't see the logic in cutting keywords into categories, or putting emphasis on the first keyword.
....
A wiki to give examples of keywords is all that is necessary to get things moving in the right direction.  Extension creators are going to use there own keywords anyhow.

My original idea was a simple tagging with no categories

+1

While I feel my reasoning on partial matches is sound, It's only an opinion. I suspect roberts will make the final
decision on that.

Undoubtedly the decision remains in those who develop, this does not mean that the discussion can not make him focus on ideas.

I get the feeling you are still not grasping that the first tag is used as an index and must come from the CATEGORIES column.

It does not matter if I did not understand it, is important when thousands of people will not understand it (not because what you say is strange, but it's simply a fact of randomness) 

That's why the WIKI page is there, to guide people when searching for an extension. If necessary, a link could be added to the Tinycore website to make its existence more obvious.

I think the guide could be a good thing for those who want to learn more (user or packager that is), but make the reading of a guide obligatory for the use of a search field would be like to ask anyone necessarily the use of a reference for use google (for example).
It is best to leave the order on their own judgment rather than risk the incomprehension of the search function.

All this always imho, of course

[Rich]

Personally I don't see the logic in cutting keywords into categories, or putting emphasis on the first keyword.

Categories serve two purposes:
1. It provides a keyword that defines what you are interested in doing, then guides you to a few more keywords to
    narrow the search a little further.
2. It speeds up the search function. Since it sounds like the search will be implemented on the ibiblio server, speed
    matters. As a shared resource, you don't want the server performing more work than necessary.

A wiki to give examples of keywords is all that is necessary to get things moving in the right direction.  Extension creators are going to use there own keywords anyhow.

If "Extension creators are going to use there own keywords anyhow", then there is no point to the WIKI page or
this discussion.

For example, I suggest
Include the category - office
Change web to - internet

I placed  office  under  editors  because that's what those packages are used for. They just contain multiple editors
for handling formatted text, spreadsheets, PDFs, etc., and to the best of my knowledge there are only 2 or 3
packages. Having said that, if you feel breaking out  office  into a separate category would be more intuitive, I'll
be happy to do that.
I used  web  because  web browser  and  web server sounded more natural, but internet is fine too.

My original idea was a simple tagging with no categories. However if community is preferring categories,

Which so far does not seem to be the case.

why not use freedesktop.org categories (including sub-categories) instead of reinventing the wheel? Even if this is not perfect is ready and for sure they went through the pain.

Actually, I used freedesktop.org as a source for ideas and tags. What they call  Main Category  and  Additional
Category  I called  CATEGORIES  and  FUNCTIONS. I just tried to make the list concise to try to avoid the question
of whether xyzzy.tcz belongs in category A or category B. The freedesktop.org standard allows for a lot of ambiguity.

And it woulb be useful in DE supporting freedekstop.org like LXDE, Xfce4, KDE? Gnome.

I'm sorry, I don't understand the question.

Undoubtedly the decision remains in those who develop, this does not mean that the discussion can not make him focus on ideas.

Agreed.

It does not matter if I did not understand it, is important when thousands of people will not understand it (not because what you say is strange, but it's simply a fact of randomness) 

Then I apologize for proposing such a random search idea.

I think the guide could be a good thing for those who want to learn more (user or packager that is), but make the reading of a guide obligatory for the use of a search field would be like to ask anyone necessarily the use of a reference for use google (for example).
It is best to leave the order on their own judgment rather than risk the incomprehension of the search function.

You are right, making the reading of instructions on how something works obligatory is simply wrong. Yes, Google
is good example of how this should be done. Search for  sed command  and you get 2,130,000 results. Search
for  sed command linux  and you get 15,700,000 results, narrowing my search down very nicely. And luckily, you
don't need to read any instructions on how to tell Google not to remove one of your search terms so it can return
more results.

You seem to be focused on the searcher to be free to pick any words to find an app, the packager is free to pick
any words to describe the app, and there should be no rules or restrictions. Fine, please explain the magic that
will be used to match the two.

I'm at a point where I'm starting to feel obligated to take up a collection to buy a seatbelt for roberts chair, so that
does not fall out of it from laughing so hard.

[coreplayer2]

Based on search performance, I can see the merit of using categories.   Maybe I don't fully understand the concept but I foresee a conflict when matching an extension description to a category, to some degree all is good if the app description fits many categories but it's the extension which don't fit any category that presents a dilemma?

 How to resolve that?

[roberts]

Tag squencing will not be enforced.

[Guy]

My original idea was a simple tagging with no categories. However if community is preferring categories, why not use freedesktop.org categories (including sub-categories) instead of reinventing the wheel? Even if this is not perfect is ready and for sure they went through the pain.

It think this is a good idea. It is good to have a standard guide, so everyone takes a similar approach.

If someone has an app which is best described with a word or words not included in the list, those words can still be used. But the key words should come from the list.

[Guy]

Rich, everyone appreciates the time and effort you have put in, but what do you think of replacing the info on the wiki page with the categories from freedesktop.org?

If users think we can improve on the freedesktop.org list, share your ideas. But it is a good starting point.

[mocore]

Rich, everyone appreciates the time and effort you have put in, but what do you think of replacing the info on the wiki page[1] with the categories from freedesktop.org?

If users think we can improve on the freedesktop.org[2] list, share your ideas. But it is a good starting point.

one thing i would be very sorry to see go (before it even realy appeared) if this was to happen is the 'driver' tag/category

from my view
 separation of
      -system-specific
      things that are needed for basic system functionality (aka drivers: eg  disk,video,network,printer,ect) .. things most "normal/casual" users are less aware of *
 and
      -user-specific
      non system critical processes aka application's  that are things that are entirely optional  and wide ranging (eg, browser and wireshark both need network)
     
 seems to offer advantage
for example

if im looking for wireless support , i dont need to know about any applications , i just want to connect to my network!
and if i have my wifidriver + connection-mgr (presumably after being pointed to the wiki) , i no-longer need lists of wifi network-drivers

 wireless i think is a good example as it has come up on the forums
 and because connection manager  needed by most to make use of the connection  , but it is user choice which to use
 so it seems (to me at least) to fit some place between " system-specific " and " user-specific "

hope some of the above is intelligible
.. in case it is not
 
i think we need a "drivers" TAG! for modules especially as they are mostly created by the tc-team

[1]http://wiki.tinycorelinux.net/wiki:finding_applications
[2]http://standards.freedesktop.org/menu-spec/1.0/apa.html
*(yes some driver modules are already included included with in core out of necessity/convenience )

[vinnie]

What would happen if at some point the list should change at the appearance of new issues?

Tag squencing will not be enforced.

If I understand this is good news, means to support both the optimization performance of Rich and the fanciful estrus of myself? 

[Rich]

If someone has an app which is best described with a word or words not included in the list, those words can still be used. But the key words should come from the list.

Which is why I included optional tags in my examples, to allow someone to add specific details. My intent was to
make it easy to find applications based on what you want to do, not how it is implemented.

Rich, everyone appreciates the time and effort you have put in, but what do you think of replacing the info on the wiki page with the categories from freedesktop.org?

(freedesktop.org) If that's what everyone wants, thats fine. While it is intended to define how a desktop menu is
laid out, it could be made to be workable. I suggest that anyone who thiks this is a better approach read that site
very carefully. Don't just read the categories. Read the rules they give and look at the way they interrelate those
categories. Then think about the actual implementation. I'll give a few examples.
Under Main Category:
AudioVideo, Audio, Video.   Really?
Graphics.   OK, maybe I want to edit, view, whatever. Now lets see whats under addition categories:

OCR                           Optical character recognition application                                         Graphics;Scanning
Photography              Camera tools, etc.                                                                            Graphics or Office
Publishing                 Desktop Publishing applications and Color Management tools        Graphics or Office
Viewer                       Tool to view e.g. a graphic or pdf file                                               Graphics or Office

We get multiple choice for the Main Category to put something under. Continuing under addition categories:

Amusement                A simple amusement

There's a nonsensical category for you.

Electronics                 Electronics software, e.g. a circuit designer   
Engineering               Engineering software, e.g. CAD programs

And these two they couldn't even figure out what Main Category to put them under. My personal opinion is that
if the consensus is to adopt this as a standard, you look before you leap.

@dubcore: I agree, drivers is an important category.

What would happen if at some point the list should change at the appearance of new issues?

If an application can not be properly classified, categories and/or tags can be added. Moving, changing,
or removing of categories/tags, while not impossible, is much more difficult to do once a system is adopted.
This holds true for the freedesktop.org list as well as my own.

If I understand this is good news, means to support both the optimization performance of Rich and the fanciful estrus of myself?

No, it means that search speed will be sacrificed so that you can put tags in any order. The first tag would NOT
have to be from the column labeled CATEGORIES.

[vinnie]

Code: [Select]

No, it means that search speed will be sacrificed so that you can put tags in any order. The first tag would NOT have to be from the column labeled CATEGORIES.
Well I got it wrong, I are still happy that we can do research in any order (I'm sorry that things do not can coexist)

Code: [Select]

If an application can not be properly classified, categories and/or tags can be added. Moving, changing, or removing of categories/tags, while not impossible, is much more difficult to do once a system is adopted.
This holds true for the freedesktop.org list as well as my own.However, according to the decision just above, this should not cause failure during the search.
Regarding the list, I do not pronounce, though I think the freedesktop list is valid only for programs with starters.desktop

[Rich]

Hi vinnie

However, according to the decision just above, this should not cause failure during the search.

Probably not.

Regarding the list, I do not pronounce, though I think the freedesktop list is valid only for programs with starters.desktop

As I said, that list was intended to define how the desktop menu should be laid out.

[roberts]

Where's the beef? I cannot start cooking without the main ingredient!
So far 23 out of 3689 extensions have a Tags item.
I have already stated that each word will be evaulated so lets get started..

[nomer]

I didn't realize that a decision had been made. I'll try to email new *.info files for my packages by the end of the week.

Here is what I've deduced from the preceding discussion:
   I should add a single line starting with "Tags:" underneath the "Extension_by:" line.
   This line should contain a list of space separated keywords following the guidelines here, but not limiting myself to those.
   Also, it wouldn't hurt to follow the ordering specified on at the link I supplied, because even though the search function doesn't  currently pay attention to ordering now, it will make updating the *.info file easier.

I hope that I've not misunderstood anything too badly,
Nomer