Is TCL's philosophy of minimalism going the wrong way!?

[CNK]

Do you gain some size of compressing the files (like iso) before uploading them?
Archiving files can be stored compressed.

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ls -lh /mnt/data/oldtc/4.x/x86/release/CorePlus-4.7.7.iso
-rw-rw-r-- 1 debian debian 65M Sep 15  2013 /mnt/data/oldtc/4.x/x86/release/CorePlus-4.7.7.iso

xz -z -c CorePlus-4.7.7.iso > /tmp/CorePlus-4.7.7.iso.xz

ls -lh /tmp/CorePlus-4.7.7.iso.xz
-rw-rw-r-- 1 debian debian 64M Oct 23 23:12 /tmp/CorePlus-4.7.7.iso.xz

Since the initrd and squashfs files inside are already compressed, there's not much to be gained from compressing the ISOs.

There's probably more to be gained from compressing all the text files in the repo. That could be done automatically by putting everything on a compressed filesystem, but I don't want to try setting that up at this point.

For my archive I've decided to exclude the /archive, /release_candidates, and /tcz/backup directories, so I just keep the final state of each version. The actual command I'm using with Rsync is:

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rsync --progress --skip-compress=tcz,gz,bz2,xz,zip,rar,7z,iso --chmod=a+r -p -h -l -z -t -r --exclude='*/archive/*' --exclude='*/release_candidates/*' --exclude='*/backup/*' rsync://mirrors.dotsrc.org/tinycorelinux/[1-9][0.]*x oldtc

Looks like it should be done by the morning. The web server is running here:
http://130.162.192.79/oldtc/

It'll get a domain name when I get around to doing the DNS settings, and I'll set up an FTP server too.

[neonix]

Is TCL's philosophy of minimalism going the wrong way!?

Yes, it goes wrong way many years ago.

Removing tce extensions (copy2fs is too complicated for newbies, tce and tcz directory would be simpler)
Prohibition of posting links of extensions (puppy linux forum don't have this problem)
Removing 1/2/3/ repo (you should rent commerial server for 1/2/3) tinycorelinux.com
Slitaz has its own iso generator
Standard iso should have web browser out of the box.
TinyCore and Core Plus should have desktop extensions inside core.gz
rootfs.gz and modules.gz should be only in microcore

Linux community suffers from lack of minimalistic web browser, office editor, xserver, fast booting/hibernation, gpu support/widescreen, eyecandy minimalistic window manager, complicated instalation.

[nick65go]

Yes, it goes wrong way many years ago.
...
Linux community suffers from lack of minimalistic web browser, office editor, xserver, fast booting/hibernation, gpu support/widescreen, eyecandy minimalistic window manager, complicated instalation.

+1 ; LINUX (with millions of genial brains?) missing a SMALL web-browser capable of basic/simpler Javascript (need by banking logins)

+2; firmware "stupid" /greedy manufactures (HP, DELL, ASUS) not care about linux, make many not-functional keyboards, power consumption huge vs. M$winbloat-10/11

+3; stupid huge GPU-blobs for AMD CPU firmware; LLVM of 100+ MB for mesa? O.M.G.

+4; GTK3/4 big dependency for even simple editors, file managers?

+5; big Xorg, need for UEFI; almost nobody could buy today a PC with BIOS.

FYI: Why you use an OS (Linux, Max, Windows) for? 
1.For employees, the employer provides the tools (computer with its policy restrictions). 
2. For entrepreneurs (with a business to run) you use OS with strong security (not toys!). 
3. So yeah, Linux could be for personal/community hobbies, for games and wasting spare time. <- Me here.

[GNUser]

+4; GTK3/4 big dependency for even simple editors, file managers?

Hi nick65go. There are several GUI text editors and file managers that don't require GTK or qt. xfe file manager and xfw text editor immediately come to mind. I've been using xfe for years and have been extremely happy with it.

[nick65go]

GNUser, thank you. I am very aware about many alternatives  , and indeed I used xfe & co. But I am upset with the rest.

I was forced to use UEFI from January 2016 (near latest laptop) until 2023. It allows BIOS simulation but then it saw just 4 GB RAM instead of 8 GB RAM. Also HP (f**k them!) firmware has bugs: dmesg shows that it does not allow PCI ACPI low SATA power management, few Fn-keys (video luminosity +/-) not reconised, so I need to map them to scripts to use them etc. But in Windows 10 all was OK. Because extra heating, these bugs prematury destroyied my APU /GPU + the cooling pasta and now the latop runs noisy. In the end I bought a new laptop (again UEFI +Win11).

But there are other linux not solved problems , in general: huge CPU microcode to load initialy, huge GPU firmware for AMD kernel drivers. Then Xorg ask for its 3D drivers which depend on LLVM (100+MB). 

Now, even without all those (firmware + drivers big size), I need a secure browser for banking, so firefox is mandatory. But this sucker asks for GTK3 and all its dependency hell.

Summary: it  does not help me too much if FEW software are small, but mostly all others have huge demands.
Today I have no problem because I have a lot of RAM (32 GB) +SSD (1000 GB) +CPU (13th gen) for shiny/bloated Win11. But I am still afraid about extra heating because HP firmware not suitable for linux (distroing my investment/laptop).

My observation is that LINUX (not necesary Tinycore) goes in the wrong direction for me. And TC must keep aligned with increased kernel, bloated software (asking for biger libc, not compiling old software, etc). And today Win11 is 10x over my needs in Security + Functionality: Edge/Firefox + 7zip + Notepad++ , MSOffice/LibreOffice and VLC covers 110%. The incentives to switch back to Linux are constantly dimishing. I like linux and minimalism but sometime the price is too harsh.

[CNK]

Looks like it should be done by the morning. The web server is running here:
http://130.162.192.79/oldtc/

It'll get a domain name when I get around to doing the DNS settings, and I'll set up an FTP server too.

All done. See the announcement thread

[Stefann]

First CNK thanks for this. If there was a thankyou button inwon”d have used it.
And others thanks for the ramblings to get tot this point.

Second, to counterweight the comments of neonix,
I very much like the minimalistic approach.
I like the concept of “minimal out of the box” with application browser that allows app install for many needs.
It is very true that without installing extra applications one can not do much with tinycore, but actually that is the function of an os. “Be just that”.
To bring tinycore to become a useabale desktop one indeed needs to install applications, but the process to that I consider reasonably smooth.
The big advantage of keeping it minimal is the ability to have a full functional very small footprint Linux system with latest kernel and latest gcc.
For me that makes tinycore the ideal base to create a “luxerous plc”. Like arduino it allows to create a low ram, low cpu board and than adds the advantage of having a full functional Linux on it running from ram (not wearing flash storage). Ideal for small tasks. I really like that I don’t have to carry a full fetched multi gigabyte os to achieve that.
Also… I’m tuning my tinycore to be super stable. (Ref to thread about making sure /var/log/wtmp rotating). I’m very happy I don’t have to do that towards a much bigger package.

So… yeah… it’s minimal. It’s tiny.. for me that is the beauty. That is the “reason to choose tinycore”. Example the DSL 2024 project is going in a direction of “minimal but more complete”. It’s there. No reason for tinycore to do the same. I feel each projects has its focus. That focus gives it its value for a specific range of users. I would really advocate to keep that focus. That will secure a good plurality of choices for those who want to select a distribution that fits their needs.

A bit of a long post. But I did feel the need to post a counter word.

[gadget42]

@nick65go congratulations on the new laptop! which model number did you purchase?

[gadget42]

searched the forum for "tinycore is a toolkit", got 4 hit, seem legit, indeed, fantastic!

awesome crew, thanks to all who do!

does that qualify as a Haiku?

as in: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiku

but you could also enjoy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiku_(operating_system)_

20241025-0355am-cdt-usa-modified: added content and links

[nick65go]

@nick65go congratulations on the new laptop! which model number did you purchase?

laptop model: HP 17-cn34, with 17 inch display, 32 GB RAM, 500 GB SSD, Intel core i5-1335U (an APU=CPU+GPU, CPU=13th gen low power, GPU=Intel Iris Xe), software Windows 11 Pro + MS Office 2021 Pro (perpetuate license for life), price 779 euros (on October 2023).

something like this, for details:
APU: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raptor_Lake#Raptor_Lake-U
laptop: https://www.amazon.de/HP-17-Windows-Funkmaus-Notebooktasche/dp/B096S8L2ZG/

PS: It is not Tiny Core TEAM fault for the bad HP/DELL/ASUS firmware in my PC/laptops. Unfortunately I buy laptops using public/EXTERNAL specifications (CPU/RAM/SDD, price). IF/when the UEFI firmware is proper for Linux kernel then I prefer linux instead of Windows11. But was seldom happen for me until now.

[gadget42]

@nick65go thanks for the information. i visited that amazon link you provided and saw this

Product description

Note:

This device is a new product, which has been optimised for you in cooperation between manufacturer and seller.

The device has been modified and optimised - it is already configured and installed.

All required drivers and Windows updates are installed and the device is delivered completely free of advertising software.

Just turn it on and get started!

Legal Disclaimer

Disclaimer does not exist.

yikes! sounds like something Edward Snowden warned us about!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Snowden

[nick65go]

@gadget42: This toy (was new, now it is one year old) has no personal documents on it (they lay in on-demand external USB, for offline use) is for my ground play (learning, entertainment). So any agency of 3 or more letters (CIA, FBI, NSA, bla bla) from USA, UK, EU, China, Russia, (or other with imperialist dreams) ... are welcome to waste their time to spy my ass.